NAS Streaming可以比CD靚聲嗎？CH Precision C1來告訴你

Bubble

里克1 發表於 2014-7-22 11:37
個討論令我呢個非電腦人用家知道多咗. 幾好幾好.

我都好同意，幾位師兄的理性討論和無私分享背後都有很多知識理據支持。

Bubble

diamondblack 發表於 2014-7-21 15:04
The use of optical fiber is not merely for network isolation, it acts like a filter in the signal  ...

分享的確很受用。

la1209

非常非常好的一個post

Audiophilelp

As I said yesterday , this is a good post and sharing!
Anyway it is already off topic from the beginning
I hope debate / sharing =/= argue / dispute.

charleslinnfans

講翻 a pair of fibre convertors, if electricity also cleaned by alpha digital PC (plug to LPS), will we still need fibre convertors ?

It seems fibre convertors is for extension purpose (because lan has limitation of few  meters but optical fibre  can be few kilometers.

Also few years ago cat7 with ftp/stp not very common than nowadays, cat7 cable is well shielded (e.g. Sanwa) and not expensive (just about HK$100 for 2 meters).

diamondblack

charleslinnfans 發表於 2014-7-22 15:05
講翻 a pair of fibre convertors, if electricity also cleaned by alpha digital PC (plug to LPS), will ...

Power cords usually have no filtering function.

charleslinnfans

diamondblack 發表於 2014-7-22 15:28
Power cords usually have no filtering function.

TECHNOLOGY
The functional core of the ΞTRON™ α DIGITAL is a hybrid ΞTRON™ circuit which demonstrates a measurable reduction of power line noise. The ΞTRON™ α DIGITAL is essentially a dedicated power conditioner without the associated chassis, extra outlets, added cost and extra power cable of a traditional power conditioner!

http://shunyata.com/index.php/po ... -2#!alphadigital_ac



Very efficient solution:-
Just need to plug 1 Alpha Digital PC between Wallet (Shunyata SR-Z1) and LPS, while another socket end plug to Hydra AV (I use Zitron Cobra 20A), suprisingly, that Alpha Digital PC helps to clean up my other components' digital noise connecting to Hydra AV, include my TV, pre-amp and even class D power amps (mono) x 2.

nickif

Audiophilelp 發表於 2014-7-22 14:01
As I said yesterday , this is a good post and sharing!
Anyway it is already off topic from the begin ...

完全不會off topic，這個ＰＯＳＴ的本意之一就是大家分享玩ＣＡＳ的心得，一起把ＣＡＳ玩到最好！

diamondblack

charleslinnfans 發表於 2014-7-22 17:00
TECHNOLOGY
The functional core of the ΞTRON™ α DIGITAL is a hybrid ΞTRON™ circuit which demon ...

That would filter away some noise from the grid but that won't be as effective as the optical fibre solution. If you have all the ingredients in place, I suggest setting up the optical fibre solution, and use the Shunyata Digital on the power supply (hopefully a linear one) that powers up the optical-ethernet converter on the "clean" side, i.e. the one nearer to the streamer/dac.

kahw

Very nice report!
I ordered the fiber box too.
Will see how much improvement I get here.

tleonard

diamondblack 發表於 2014-7-22 15:28
Power cords usually have no filtering function.

用嚟玩 daisy chain 都得：

ACOUSTIC REVIVE RAS-14tripleC-FM

http://www.phileweb.com/news/audio/201405/18/14470.html

ACOUSTIC REVIVE RAS-14

http://www.acoustic-revive.com/japanese/ras14/ras14_01.html

Aug-Line Terminator PW

http://aug-line.com/products/terminator-pw

Furutech Flux-50
Furutech Flow-28
Furutech Flow-15

http://www.furutech.com/products/finished-cables/in-line-power-filter

Furutech The Suppressor CF-080（AC Connector Damping Ring）

http://www.furutech.com/2013/03/19/3120

MIT Magnum Z Trap

http://ww2.mitcables.com/available-in-stores/magnum-z-trap.html

MIT Shotgun Z Trap

http://ww2.mitcables.com/available-in-stores/shotgun-z-trap.html

【集體試聽】Furutech、Acoustic Revive、MIT AC濾波

http://www.my-hiend.com/vbb/showthread.php?3492

最佳組合
MIT Magnum Z Trap + Furutech Flux-50 Filter
一整個超強，好像系統上了一大成功力，瘋狂的人買這兩條一起用一定讓您爽到翻
不僅音響性好，整個細節形體都非常完整

次佳組合
MIT Magnum Z Trap + Acoustic Revive RAS-14
跟前面組合相比，少了些點力道與分明的特性，但多了些特殊迷人的質感與韻味，細節也很豐富

老三組合
Furutech Flux-50 Filter + Acoustic Revive RAS-14
強調講究中高頻者之特效藥

MIT Magnum Z Trap USD 1199
Furutech Flux-50 Filter ￥79,800
毫無疑問，這兩個屬於等級比較接近的產品，不過聲音走向完全不一樣，FurutechFlux-50 Filter讓聲音的型體變得更為凝聚，相對來說的空間感定位與層次更為明確分明，低頻更沉更快，讓人覺得人聲與樂器更為真實，Magnum Z Trap力道衝擊力強，聲音強弱分明，形體跟原本差不多，簡單來說Furutech Flux-50 Filter讓聲音更為明確具有音響性，而Magnum Z Trap則是不刻意強調變化，然而在細微中細膩的變化描繪的更為清楚。

Acoustic Revive RAS-14 ￥59,850
聲音較為溫暖，有獨特的韻味在，解析力亦有升，當沒有前面兩者這麼突顯，若覺得系統太利，這個是很好的選擇

MIT Shotgun Z Trap USD 699
簡單說，就是老大的5成功力左右，有幫助，但聽過老大之後....所以預算夠就買老大吧

Furutech Flow-28 ￥39,900
簡單說，就是老大的5成功力左右，不過考量價差，沒預算買這也是不錯的選擇

rogerchou

nickif 發表於 2014-7-22 00:50
There was a saying I can't agree more: If you can hear the difference, it must can be measured, the  ...

你的說法不盡然是"MUST"的。
很大一部分,你所謂聽到的聲音不同是心理因素而不是機器因素。在70~80年代認知心理學裡已經解釋很多人腦對眼睛(看到的)與耳(聽到的)的解讀認知有很大誤差,簡單講就是人腦會"誤判"人所看到或聽到的,這類實證通常是強調人腦有先入為主的主觀(Subjective)行為,當實驗中快速進行聽力或視力的分辨時,往往產生很大誤差。
舉一我高中真實例子:我有一同學數學成績很不錯,但分班考試時數學成績不理想,考60題選擇題只對50題,他與他父母大鬧學校要申訴,一口咬定學校讀卡機錯誤,無法正確讀取他的答案卡。後來學校同意人工核對答案卡,結果也是一樣...多年後,出社會再碰到他,他還是一樣對分班事件耿耿於懷。
人不可能聽出Digital Data在RIP或傳輸過程中對聲音的差異,除非data有傳遞loss,而此loss在聽感上是瞬間沒聲音或破音。Jitter對聲音的確有影響,但此jitter不會"累加",只會存在最終數位轉類比時re-clock那個裝置上,可以是CD Player也可以是DAC。類比資料傳遞在任何一階段都會受各種不同的設備與線材影響,其各階段影響會累加或交互影響,因為它傳遞的方法是用"波長"去衡量。

tleonard

There's no such thing as digital: A conversation with Charles Hansen, Gordon Rankin, and Steve Silberman

The Terra Firma Concept: Jitter is Analogue

---

Hi-Fi News is no stranger to cable reviews but we’ve resisted the temptation to entertain the idea of ‘USB cable sound’ until now. Ten key brands are featured and all auditioned blind...

http://mvicha.sweb.cz/test%20USB%20kabelu.pdf

Hi-Fi News is no stranger to cable reviews and was the first to offer an authoritative account of ‘USB cable sound’ in 2013. Now, another ten brands are featured and all auditioned blind...

http://mvicha.sweb.cz/test%20USB%20kabelu%202014.pdf

Still not exactly sure about how it goes, maybe both digital and analog are present simultaneously?

Data= digital

Noise = analog

Electricity = analog

Analog and Digital

Could that be more or less like Yin and Yang, they're complementary to each other rather than the opposite?

diamondblack

tleonard 發表於 2014-7-23 02:44
用嚟玩 daisy chain 都得：

ACOUSTIC REVIVE RAS-14tripleC-FM

That's why I said usually. I have Isotek Syncro in my system which its most distinguishable feature is a DC filter component.

You can always add filters to your system, whether it's an extension of the power cord, or a standalone mains filter such as Shunyata and Isotek. From my experience optical-ethernet conversion is a better filter standalone (given it's equipped with some cleaner source of power) for the digital signal path than mains filtering. It's the best both work together as the converters need clean AC/AC-converted DC electricity.

Bubble

rogerchou 發表於 2014-7-23 04:05
你的說法不盡然是"MUST"的。
很大一部分,你所謂聽到的聲音不同是心理因素而不是機器因素。在70~80年代認 ...

這個digital transmission和Analog transmission用在對聲音影響方面既理解幾有趣，請問有沒有一些文章可提供更詳細的了解？

即是話資源放在改善analog transmission的一段較放在digital transmission的一段易見效。

obee

Bubble 發表於 2014-7-23 13:24
這個digital transmission和Analog transmission用在對聲音影響方面既理解幾有趣，請問有沒有一些文章可 ...

即是話資源放在改善analog transmission的一段較放在digital transmission的一段易見效

一定, 但要分清楚乜野係digital先.

Bubble

obee 發表於 2014-7-23 13:51
一定, 但要分清楚乜野係digital先.

好似diamondblack話齊，鑽得愈深，學問愈多

里克1

我最唔明係同一隻碟係就算用唔同software, 唔同器材, rip 出嚟原來係會完全一樣...

diamondblack

里克1 發表於 2014-7-23 14:28
我最唔明係同一隻碟係就算用唔同software, 唔同器材, rip 出嚟原來係會完全一樣... ...

我的經驗是只限於checksum一樣

我收口了......

里克1

明白明白.  rip CD dbpoweramp 已經好夠用, rip 出來效果很穏定.  但SACD rip 出來就很不稳定,  有何方法可check checksum?